RTL Episode 67: How to Heal After Loss

RTL PodcastHealthWellnessFertility
Written By Josephine Atluri
 
 

We’re kicking off 2022 by recapping some of our favorite episodes from the past three seasons. In six special podcast episodes, we’ll highlight some of the best tips and advice from our previous guests. In this fourth bonus episode, we're discussing a very sensitive topic that may be triggering for some of you who are currently on your path to parenthood or are one of the 1 in 4 who has experienced pregnancy loss or miscarriage. Featured in this episode are the courageous stories of how to heal after experiencing loss.

Episode 67 Transcript

Josephine Atluri (00:08):

Welcome to the Responding to Life podcast. We are continuing on with special bonus episodes, featuring guests from the last three seasons of the podcast. In this episode, we're discussing a very sensitive topic that may be triggering for some of you who are currently on your path to parenthood, or are the one in four who has experienced pregnancy loss or miscarriage. In this episode, I'm sharing the courageous stories of how to heal after experiencing loss. In this episode, you will hear from authors Kim Hooper, Samantha Busch, and Monica Bivas, doula Linny Stone, entrepreneur Tina Sugandh, and advocate, Kelsi Burley. The first fertility advocate we will be hearing from is Samantha Busch. Samantha is a wife, mother, entrepreneur, lifestyle blogger, IVF advocate, philanthropist, and co-owner of a professional race team. As a successful boss babe, Samantha is driven to empower women of all ages and backgrounds to live their best lives with confidence and poise.

(01:13):

Her book 'Fighting Infertility' celebrated its one year anniversary this past March in the book, she shares her battle with infertility, including her IVF experience miscarriage, a failed cycle, and the overwhelming grief and depression that surrounded these obstacles with this memoir, her aim is to break the silence and stigma that surrounds the infertility community. In this clip you're about to hear, Samantha shares with us her experience of loss, in particular, how she grieved the loss of her daughter while mothering her firstborn child. She'll also detail how it can be hard to cope with your partner's grief process when it looks different from your own experience.

(01:52):

You went on to go through IVF and, and then you birth your beautiful son, Brexton, who is just, I love looking at his pictures on your, on your feed. He's so handsome.

Samantha Busch (02:07):

Thank you.

Josephine Atluri (02:09):

Yeah, it just, it, it brings a smile to my face. Every time I can see that people had, you know, their happy ending with the birth of a child, but then after that point, you decided to continue to grow your family and you began IVF again. And at that point you experienced a miscarriage and I'm so sorry for your last Samantha, you know, the pain stays what with us forever. I know from losing my own twins in my second trimester that it just it's almost can haunt you at random times. Yes. so my have heard my story of my grief process, which is like feeling the full expression of your feelings and taking the time and then finding hope to move on. So I'd love for you to share with us how you dealt with the grief and loss of your daughter.

Samantha Busch (02:55):

So we decided to go through IVF again when Brexton you know, he was potty trained, he was sleeping. We felt like we were in a good place. And I was so confident. And I guess now looking back very naive because when we went through IVF the first time, I mean partially because my P C O S we retrieved 34 eggs, 15 fertilized, eight of them ended up making it. We had, you know, we put the first embryo Brexton in and he took, and I had a healthy pregnancy. And so to me, there was no reason that that wasn't going to happen again. And so for our second round, I was like, you know what, Kyle, I'm gonna document everything. I want people who are gonna go on this journey to see, to feel, to hear it all so that they're not as nervous about going into it.

(03:46):

I was like, I wanna show them the shots and the embryo transfer and the medicines, and like just this really real account of what happens. That's not doom and gloom, but that's like, Hey, look, I hate needles. If I could do this, you could do this. If I could do this, you know, being on a plane four days out of the week, like, here's how you can do it if you're traveling or if you're working or if you have kids, like, I just really wanted to have this really awesome, positive, like empowering account of it. And so we started filming everything and documenting it all. And we went, we did the embryo transfer and you know, Brexton was so excited. We were very open and honest with him. And then, you know, we did the transfer waited the 12 days, got the positive test.

(04:32):

And, and since we had been sharing everything, we told people right away, like, yes, we're pregnant. Everything's great. We announced it on Thanksgiving. We did a photo shoot that day. Brexton had his big brother shirt on and we were in front of the Christmas tree and, and we made our Christmas cards to basically beat, you know, our announcement just on cloud nine. You know, like, this is great. This was, we felt good that, you know, people are like, oh, thanks for sharing all, like, I've learned so much, I'm not nervous anymore. And we're like, yes, this is what God called us to do. Like, you know, obviously besides our foundation like this, this is what we're meant to do with this platform is to just make the topic of IVF normalized and talked about and people to feel good. And it was just a few days after we announced I was playing with Brexton and I started bleeding really bad.

(05:26):

And I go into a lot of detail of it in the book, but, you know, we ended up going to the doctor and it was what was a threatened miscarriage where you know, she was still in there. She was much smaller than they had, but my cervix was closed. So they're like, we can't, you know, your numbers have still gone up since the last time. So we can't really tell you. And so then I had to wait 48 hours, which happened to put us in Las Vegas for the NASCAR championship banquet weekend. And I've had a lot of people ask me like, well, why did you go? And the thought of being home by myself and without Kyle who was like my rock through all of this, just like terrified me. You know, I, I just, I, I can't, I can't like, we're gonna go, it's gonna be okay.

(06:20):

I read online like threatened miscarriages half the time they work out fine. Like, I'm just gonna, this is gonna be part of our story, right? Like, I'm gonna tell her when she's little, how, you know, she was always, you know, scaring me from day one and, and, and was strong and, and a fighter and all these things. And so we went for the blood test and, and the thing was, I had stopped bleeding. Like the day I left the office, after I got checked within an hour after I had blood and blood and blood, there was nothing, nothing at all. And I was like, that has to be a good sign. So, you know, we went out to Vegas, we did blood work getting ready for the banquet, no call, no, no call, no call. And I'm like, Ugh, I'd like to know something.

(07:02):

Right. So literally they're like pinning the last of my hair and I'm getting, you know, and I'm, I'm almost ready. It's like the red carpet and 20 minutes. And the call comes in and I'm like, okay, you know, this, this is gonna be good. It's all gonna work out and get the call. And, you know, she was like, we're sorry to tell you, like, your numbers have gone down. If, if you haven't experienced any bleeding, like you'll finish essentially your miscarriage naturally in the next, you know, upcoming days. And I was like, no, no, that's, it's not true. That's not true. She's a fighter. You're like, you're lying. This, this isn't, this isn't true. This cannot be happening. Like, this is just not how it's, it's not how our story goes. It's not how it's gonna happen. And I just shut down.

(07:56):

 Like I calmly finished getting ready and I told Kyle, and it just, it wasn't registering. Like he tried to hug me and I was like, no, I'm fine. Don't hug me. Like, no, this is they're wrong. Like they're gonna come back and, and it's gonna, it's, it's fine. It, this isn't true. And then the days to come, I finished miscarrying, which was just like overwhelming knowing and, and having to like, almost go through it twice, if that makes sense. Mm-Hmm <affirmative> and it was just so devastating. And then, you know, for the days and the weeks to come, I don't know a better word to say than you're just, you're in a rut. Like, I didn't want to go do anything. I didn't really wanna talk to anyone. I would literally spend all of my energy, trying to be a good mom. And like, it just pour myself into attempting every day to pretend to be a normal person.

(08:59):

When in the inside, like everything was just falling apart, learning that we grieve different. And that just because he might be in one place and I might be in another, there's no timeline. And just figuring out how to support at each other in the right ways and, and things to say to each other or not to say to each other. And, and we learned a lot from a therapist on just how to talk with each other. I would love to sit with Kyle and just talk and talk and talk and vent and tell him how his feeling and tell him what, you know, all the things I was feeling all the time about the miscarriage, right? Like over and over and over, because it was like a release of all the sadness in me and for him, he was like, I don't want to constantly relive this.

(09:50):

Like it hurts. And I don't, you know, like I've held your hand through it, but now we have to move forward. Our therapist was like, look, we're gonna set a 10 or a 15 minute timer and a certain number of days a week that you both agree on right here right now. And when you need to talk, Sam, you are gonna put this timer on Kyle. You're gonna put down your phone. You're not gonna roll your eyes. You're not gonna do the, I can't believe we have to talk about this. And you're gonna give her 10 minutes and <affirmative>, you're gonna be supportive and you're gonna talk back. And Sam, you're gonna release everything. But when that timer goes off, like it's done and you can't mop. You can't be sad. Like you got it out and now you have to move forward. And, and it took some of that. And it took that compromise. And it took both of us getting back on the same page to then be able to really heal and grieve and process. And also not only from our marriage, but the outpouring of support from the social community in this infertility sisterhood was what helped me.

Josephine Atluri (10:55):

The next you'll hear from is Kim Hooper. Kim is the author of five novels. Her personal experience of four pregnancy losses inspired her to co-write all the love, healing, your heart, and finding meaning after pregnancy loss with her friend Meredith Resnick, a licensed social worker in Kim and Meredith's episode, Kim shares her process of healing and getting grief after her four losses, how it affected her relationships and how to return back to normal life. After experiencing a loss

Kim Hooper (11:27):

Starting in 2015, I I lost my first pregnancy and then I, I ended up having four losses in total. My first loss was an ectopic pregnancy, and then I had had an early miscarriage. And then I lost my son in the second trimester for my third pregnancy. And then my fourth was another ectopic pregnancy. Very unusual and rare. And my fifth pregnancy was totally textbook and I have a, now three and a half year old daughter. It's so common for couples to have strain after a pregnancy loss. I think one, half of the couple, usually the non gestational partner, the one who's not carrying the baby is kind of feeling the, like, they need to have be stoic and strong. And you know, while the other partner feels like they're more breaking down there can be resentments on both sides.

(12:22):

I mean, when I was going through mine, I was of course, so consumed that I didn't, I was only focused on my own resentments. Like, why can't my husband show more emotion about this? Like, why am I the only one who's feeling this upset? Did it not affect him? And I think for him and talking to him and, you know, we did little like interviews with him in the book where you kind of see his thoughts alongside mine in the book. I think he was kind of like, have I lost my wife? Like how do I get her back? You know it was very unsettling for him to see me sad and struggling because, you know, he'd kind of seen me as like a rock in our, in our life. So you know, I've kind of, I developed compassion for both people in the situation, and I think that's why we wanted to give so much attention to that topic in the book, in terms of friendships.

(13:17):

I, I think you really do realize like who can be there with you in the hard times and who is not afraid to go to that painful kind of deeper level? I mean, I, I had some friends who were saying things it's like, let me know when you're up for a happy hour <laugh> and I just kind of realized that those friends were not going to be my grief go-to friends. And sometimes you come back around to those people when life circumstances change, or sometimes you just outgrow a relationship because you just realize that you've been through so much, that's kind of changed you and you don't relate as well. So, and I think either way is fine. I don't think there's like a right or wrong about it, but I, I do feel like I kind of deepened the relationships that really mattered to me the most.

(14:11):

 And you know, some of it was painful realizing the people who weren't really the world being there for me realizing, you know, what people can give and what they can't. And then I think in time putting it in perspective of it, it's not a reflection of anything, but their own discomfort with grief. For me personally, it was very difficult. I felt kind of, and when we say normal life, I mean, we kind of say it in quotes because I mean, what is normal, especially after a loss that can be so jarring. But for me personally, it was, it was like resuming certain routines, certain socializing going back to work. And in all those instances I felt kind of disoriented is the word, like kind of just like I was on another planet. Like everybody else was kind of going about their business.

(15:02):

And I felt like I had gone through this thing. That to me was very monumental and I wasn't relating to them. So in terms of advice, or I think some of the things we talk about in the book, like, for example, if you're back at work carving out time in your day, if you can, for reprieve so that you can have a time to kind of connect with yourself in the midst of all the chaos of quote unquote normal life I, I would go to my car on lunch breaks and sort of just either breathe or just have a cry if I needed to, or use that time to just kind of text in peace or read a book. So just like a break in the day to kind of come back to myself because it, it can feel very jarring to just be thrown back in the mix of the world.

(15:55):

What's particularly hard with pregnancy loss too, is that a lot of times people don't know you were pregnant because we have this unspoken rule about not sharing a pregnancy in the first trimester, which is when the majority of miscarriages happen. So that's also very alienating. So when you're back to life and you know, you're at the gym and people are like, oh, haven't seen you in a while. How, you know, how's it going? And you just want to like cringe and crawl under a rock because how can you even answer that question in a simple way. So it can be overwhelming. I think just taking, taking space for yourself, if they're our situations like at work if there is somebody you work with that you can trust and kind of talk to and make them kind of like a person that you can lean on a little bit, if you can ask your manager, if you can have certain days where you work from home, if that's possible with the type of work you do or just having breaks in a day to kind of help ease back into things.

(16:51):

Cause I, it's just, it's difficult to get back into it. I don't, I don't know if there's any easy way.

Josephine Atluri (16:58):

My next featured guess is Monica Bivas. Monica is a mindset and holistic fertility coach, speaker, writer of the book, The IVF Planner, and founder of the IVF journey, an online community for women and couples to find support, hope and connection with other individual contemplating or experiencing in vitro fertilization. Monica's certified fertility coach from the wholesome fertility program and specializes in mindset and emotional support for individuals and couples trying to conceive via ART like IVF or IUI as well as emotional support in pregnancy and infant loss. Her book, The IVF Planner, is a journal and guide for women undergoing fertility treatment and has another book forthcoming about her life changing experience with IVF treatment and her still birth and loss experience at 39 weeks of her baby daughter, Isabelle, as well as her following miscarriage at seven weeks after trying IVF again in this next clip, you'll hear Monica's experience with two pregnancy losses, how pregnancy loss affected her marriage and how she felt carrying the second child after going through those previous losses.

Monica Bivas (18:05):

We, the first cycle and it was successful. It's now my 15 year old daughter Alia, so we said, wow, it's, it's easy. So it's gonna happen again. However, in that time, nobody explained us that we could have the chance to freeze eggs or to breathe embryos. So we didn't know the clinic didn't told us and we just, you know, have the baby and Seth together with my husband in another two, three years, we're gonna try again and it's gonna be that easy, like this first one. And we did that, but this is where really my journey start because we went back to the same doctor and we did a second cycle, but they nurse in that time in the clinic, he has only like one or two people working in the clinic. They did a mistake, switching the charts with another another patient and the dose that was put on me of the medicine was the wrong one.

(19:06):

So I got OHSS and my ovaries became bologna. So they had to cancel the, the, the cycle due to that reason. And it was really frustrating. He took responsibility for that. And he said that he's gonna give us the next cycle, but of course, you know how it is. I needed to wait it least three months for my body to clean from all the medicine and all the drugs that I, our stimulants, we jump into the third cycle and about four months later and I got pregnant I was 37 years old and everything was going okay. But 39 weeks I had ail was a stillbirth because I developed some issue with my, my blood. So a blood CLO in Indian, Billy called court, you know, basically he, my baby. So I had to go and deliver at 39 weeks, my daughter and I was very devastating.

(20:03):

I was lost emotionally, you know, wrecking my husband too. And my coping system in that time was like, I need to jump into another IBF to feel that whole, that pain to replace that baby, you know, that's, I will say a survival reaction. So I start to kind of drill my husband about that. And he was against, because he was somehow more rational. I was seeing that I need to grieve and first, and then we go there, but I was very stubborn. My re our re recommend another doctor. We went through him. He told me exactly saying that he thought that it was too fast that I need to heal, but I was totally blind. Totally. You know, deaf, I didn't listen. So we jumped into another IVF and I got pregnant, but unfortunately at seven weeks I miscarriage. So from this time, you know, like a pain and another pain, everything kind of came down, you know, like all, all, like when they say, when it rains, it bursts or something like that, <laugh>, I'm sorry.

(21:11):

My accent my, you know, my emotional state was terrible. My marriage start to crumble. We almost got divorced with my husband. It was a very terrible time. And eventually we kind of came back and talked and said, you know, we need to dedicate time for ourselves. Take a break, see if we can fix this relationship. We have already a daughter and we took a year. And after a year, we decided that we're gonna do our last try, the fifth cycle and whatever is gonna happen. We are gonna at accepted with love, and it's gonna come the way it is. So we did our life cycle. I got pregnant. It's now my seven year old daughter, Maya. When I lost her, when the still birth happened, I was like putting guilt on myself. I was like, oh my gosh, I didn't enjoy the pregnancy.

(22:06):

Or I was not connect with that. Oh, all of that. And then that kind of feelings work totally the opposite on my pregnancy with Maya, which is my fifth sixth cycle. So this is actually this fifth cycle. This pregnancy is what started to inspire me to, to work in more, being, being calm, kind of learn how to find balance, not perfection, but balance in accepting that, you know, I'm not going through a difficult, I'm not going through an easy time because IVF is not easy. I know being aware of what I am going to feel the chart of some downs, the fears, the what, if they're going to pee in the bathroom and check every time, you know, my underwear, that if I'm bleeding, all of that, being more aware and because of the loss of his was very upset on girls. And I learned that it's okay, that we can be upset on God too, because you ask, where is God, why this happened to me?

(23:09):

And I'm not a bad person. I'm a good person. I didn't do nothing, but to no one. And then it took the others week. So I learn and I say, you know what? I'm maybe I was far from God. I'm gonna start to pray more. And I bought my pregnancy book and all of that, but <laugh>, but there is always a bad when my around two weeks, I start to feel the baby, I didn't know it was a girl because I didn't know. I didn't want to know what she was. My husband wanted to know. So when we went to the sonogram, I told him, if you want to know, they can tell him, don't tell me. So they told him and they didn't tell me. And I'm like, okay with that. But when she start to move, the other thing that it was a little bit of a nightmare, because I learned so perfectly to count her movements and to see at what times exactly she will move.

(24:02):

Even when I was sleeping, she used to move. I will never forget. She used to move every time when I was sleeping between two 15 to two 30 in the morning, if this baby will not move in that range of time, I will wake up like a crazy woman, wake up my husband, almost giving him a heart attack, telling him to bring me orange juice or C because I needed to make sure that the baby will move. So I, during that pregnancy, I never let her sleep. And she's a hyper like crazy. She's a little earthquake. You <laugh>, that is my book. But that, you know, during that time, when she start to move, it was a little nightmare, but still I kind of fight to find balance. So whatever regrets we feel when we have losses, they're absolutely okay. And whatever regrets we feel when we get pregnant again, when we have had a loss, it's totally okay.

(24:59):

Because you know, there is nothing bad in life or difficult as sad that will not bring you joy. It. Why? Because that's life like it's balance, you know, like black and white. I say it like that. Why there is love because is hate from how we need to learn to switch it. You know why there is pain because there is happiness. You need to know both. So what brought me all this, this sadness of Isabelle and my miscarriage took me to a place that I needed to learn balance. And you know, what helped me to heal completely. And I can tell you that completely heal the loss of Isabelle, right? Through only believe. And this is my belief. This is my feeling that spirit babies, our kids choose us as a parent. We choose our parents actually. So I am told true that the soul of my belt is the same soul or in my Maya with different vehicle.

(26:12):

Maya is, of course she's a unique person, but it, the same toll. It came back to me that little soul. So when I lost her, when it was still, it was not the time to come. So when, when she born, when she was born, my husband was the one, the first one that saw her because they wanted also to make sure that she born good and she don't have breathing problems and all of that. And then when he brought her to me and put her on my chest, that moment, I felt you felt that I was forgiven, because like you said, that guilty feelings of, you know, when you lose a baby, I was, so I was feeling so guilty that I did something wrong, that it was my fault that I lost Isabelle. That that was one of the things that it was still there on me even after you know, after the pregnancy and all of that during the pregnancy of Maya, when I go through and he put her on my arms, I felt relief. I felt that guilty feeling was gone.

Josephine Atluri (27:16):

And now we will hear from Tina Sugandh, who dealt with her five pregnancy losses and continue to have three beautiful ch children. Tina is an international Bollywood star, reality TV, personality, and founder of Mom On Top Shop. Sugandh and her husband Tarz starred on a series of reality shows, including Bravo TV's 'Newlyweds: The First Year', an advocate for miscarriage awareness. Sugandh has publicly shared her eight pregnancies and five miscarriages. A mom of three, she encourages other women to carve their own parenting path and ignore the haters. Many of us who experience pregnancy loss are always in search of answers, but don't often know how to advocate for themselves. What questions to ask, what tests to ask for. So in this clip, Tina shares how she advocated for herself with each passing miscarriage and how she stayed connected to herself throughout this harrowing journey.

Tina Sugandh (28:11):

One in four pregnancies end in miscarriage. And I think that is so important to get out there. I had five miscarriages and initially I did not know this information and excuse me, just like a lot of women. I thought there was something wrong with me. I was like, my body's not able to do this whole baby thing what's going on. And so once I learned that information, that one in four pregnancies and miscarriage, it was not only something that made me feel more normal and less ashamed, but it was also, I made it like my life mission to just get the word out on that. And I, I actually was able to go one of the times that I was on watch what happens live with Andy Cohen. I was able to say that it was, it was during, like, I think it was the one where I did a really stupid pregnancy review.

(29:06):

And like, I, my belly was jeweled up and it was, and actually so was hubbies. It was very, very interesting. It was a very interesting show, but yeah, so I was able to say that and millions of women were listening and that was, that was honestly, I mean, I've done everything from, you know, play and jam and be on Ringo Starss' last album to, I I've just done a lot of things. I'm very grateful for, but that was probably my career highlight because of the amount of women that emailed me afterwards saying things that I'm getting goosebumps right now, talking about it. That just made me tear things that, you know, their husband blames them for their miscarriages and their family is ashamed of them for MIS it, just all these things that are just horrible.

(29:52):

So, so I would say out of all my struggles and I'm happy to go into all, all the rest <laugh>. But that was probably the biggest one. I had a mom that made me this positive. And so with, with every miscarriage what really, again, what really, really changed my mindset was again, knowing that one in four pregnancies are miscarriage miscarried, and that it's normal and it's okay. And the fact, I didn't know that in the beginning, and that was hard. That was hard thinking that there's something wrong with me and that maybe my body couldn't do this. And I'm all, like I said, I'm a positive person. My Instagram is really like about strength, trying to instill positivity to other women because I think that is everything. Attitude is everything. So yeah, that first one, it was definitely hard not knowing that information, but once I learned that it was so super common.

(30:48):

 And again, this is why I, I love what you are doing. And I thank you because the problem is that not enough women talk about it, women are ashamed of it. And, and, and, you know, if you're a private person, all do, do you do your thing? If, if it's not something you wanna talk about because you're private, that's fine. But if it's something you don't wanna talk about, because you're ashamed, I'd love for it to changed that with women. So, so what really helped me was no longer being ashamed of it realizing that I'm absolutely not alone. I mean, I've talked to so many women out it, and I was so shocked as to how many women that were willing to be open with me were just like, yeah, I had two miscarriages. Yeah. Oh yeah. I had a miscarriage and I, I not knowing how common it was.

(31:33):

I was shocked about all the women that were, you know, just, just, just went through what I went through. And so I really, I'm really grateful to all the women that do speak. And I, that's definitely what helped me along my journey. I would say. I mean, my advice, if you are going through all of this is, is just talk, just be open. You mean be gentle, but just be open. And, and another cliche communication is everything in a marriage. And I, I can't stand behind that more. It it's, it's so important in everything, especially when you're going through my gosh, my gosh, I mean, child loss and, and all of these horrible things that people endure and pregnancy can be hard. I mean, everything from the hormones and the emotions I'm already like insane as it is. And so pregnancy made me even crazier and my husband was just here for it.

(32:23):

<Laugh>, you know he was like, I he's like I marry the crazy, I'll take the crazy. And so, so yeah, I mean, I, I would just say, just communicate, just talk, just talk about gently talk about what you're feeling and what you're not feeling. And I think that's how you get through things in life. And I just think it's so important to be open and honest. I feel like if you don't discuss, like, you know, when you had a miscarriage, a, B and C, then five years later, that will come out, you'll Harbor that negativity and it'll come out a different way. So I, I think that's how we got through everything. It's just very, very open communication, gentle open communication.

Josephine Atluri (33:07):

The final two guests you will hear from are fellow for til advocates, Linny Stone and Kelsi Burley. Kelsi has gone through multiple IVF cycles and miscarriages, and is passionate about sharing information and resources as a means to educate and therefore empower women. She recently made the decision to pursue the donor egg path. Linny suffers from recurrent pregnancy loss, APS, which is a blood clotting disorder and diminished ovarian reserve. She shares her experience with loss and advocating to get answers for herself while helping spread awareness on women health and fertility issues. I'm happy to report that since our recording Linny gave birth to her beautiful daughter several months ago in this clip, you'll hear their personal stories of loss and grief as well as strategies that they employ to help them thrive and not just survive during the challenging path to parenthood.

Kelsi Burley (33:58):

So my husband and I got married in to 2017. We started trying, we stayed married for about a year before starting to try. And then in about August of 2018, we got pregnant after like a month or two of trying. So we were super excited. We were maybe five or six weeks in, and I had some heavy bleeding. And so I knew something wasn't right. I had like crazy back pain, like unreal to the point where I was like, this isn't normal. I ended up going to the emergency room and there, I found out that because I couldn't find the baby in my uterus, I found out I had an ectopic pregnancy and that's kind of where my journey began. For those who don't know what that is, it's basically when the fertilized egg implants outside of the uterus.

(34:49):

So it can't be very dangerous because it can rupture if and can cause damage to your organs and your fallopian tubes. And so so then, and there, I miscarried in the hospital after my surgery and we started trying to conceive for about another year or so, and no luck, you know, ovulation test strips, temperature, like nothing's working time to intercourse. It's just not nothing's working. So about a, I wanna say about a year after that, I went and saw my OB and he gave me a referral to get an HSG test, which is basically when they put the dye in your tubes to make sure there's, you know, a steady flow going through. And that's when I found out I had block tubes. And so they kind of chalked it up to be well it's probably because your surgery caused some scarring on your fallopian tubes and nothing can get in and out of there.

(35:49):

So that's why you're not getting pregnant. So he's like, well, there's nothing I can do. Basically from here, you need to go fertility specialist. So I stopped seeing my OB and I got referred to go see a fertility specialist, and this was December of 2019. So I started, I went to my very first appointment in 20 20th of January. And they basically were like, well, you have block tubes. You're the only option is IVF. So we're like, okay, well, this is what we're gonna have to do. It was kind of just a shock because we didn't really know what we were getting ourselves into. I look back and I'm like, wow, it was so naive going into this. I just thought like we were gonna like, you know, pay some, a hefty amount of money and go through this long drawn out process. But then we would have our baby <laugh> and then after three rounds and a miscarriage here we are to this day and I still have not, you know, have not had a baby, you know, everyone processes their grief differently and there's no right way to grieve.

(37:00):

That's the only good thing about this process is you can grieve however you want. And sometimes that means taking, you know, a week a year. It, it doesn't matter. Whatever you need for me grieving was just taking a minute to process and mourn like our loss and then find something to look forward to. So whether that be what's coming next, our next step with IVF because like I said, we had three failed rounds, which our third one ended with a miscarriage at seven weeks on our wedding anniversary. So that was that one hit me so hard. And I took a little bit extra time after that miscarriage. That was my second miscarriage. And we had actually just bought a new house. It was our first home. So having that really helped, I think, because it kept me busy and motivated and gave me something to look forward to.

(37:59):

But as before it was like, well, let's go on to the, to the next retrieval or transfer because I just wanted to keep going. Like, I'm just so motivated to get there. And I, I don't know. I just think grieving for me personally was always like, you know, just take a second to process. I, and then find something to look forward to because I, I think after my miscarriage I was in such a rut for so long. I isolated myself from my friends, my family, and it took me a while to climb back in to like everyone's life. And I was like, I don't wanna, I don't wanna do that again. I don't wanna alienate myself. My friends were there and ready to be supportive of me and I just pushed them away because I was just like so depressed. And I just I knew after this last miscarriage, I didn't want to relive that.

(38:53):

 Because not only was it hard not having the support of everyone, but it was hard to like kind of regain those friendships back and everything. Cuz I had not talked to anyone for so long. But yeah, I just think you should grieve however, feels right to you. And that's just how I personally did it. Just take things day by day. You know, I went into this and I've been so rushed trying to get to the end goal where it's not a race. You just, you need to take things day by day. And I think the whole time I was just a complete stress bucket and I think it's like, if that obstacle comes, then you can deal with a it, but there's no sense in worrying about it before, you know and ly and I have talked about that before. It's like, wait, you know, wait until, and if it even happens to worry about something, you know, don't already put those negative thoughts in your head. So I, I just think that know, just realizing that look you slow down, it's not a race, you know, whatever's gonna happen is gonna happen and there's just no control. So you have to just kind of roll with the punches and take things day by day.

Linny Stone (40:07):

So my story is that my husband and my he's my husband now, but we actually got pregnant shortly after through getting engaged and it was a surprise. We weren't trying, we, weren't not trying. But we weren't trying and it happened and I can be, you know, I'm a planner and I'm like very detailed and meticulous. And so I had kind of always hoped that that's how it would happen. That would just be a surprise because I didn't wanna stress out about everything that I'm stressing out about now. <Laugh> and so I, we got pregnant, it was a surprise and we were so happy and I just felt like, okay, this is awesome. I don't have to worry about this. And it's just gonna be easy. And then we had our ultrasound scheduled for 10 weeks. And we went in and same thing, like they couldn't find the baby.

(41:09):

 And she said that it had stopped developing and I was in shock. I didn't wanna believe it. And I'm a researcher. I just, I never take anything for what they say. I always have to do my own research. So of course I went and did, you know, my own reading and found that, you know, sometimes they can't find anything because you're off on your timing, you know, like not as far long as you thought you were. So I was like, maybe that's it. And she said, I need you to come in this, this happened on a Wednesday. And she was like, you need to come in for a D on Friday. And I was like, no, <laugh> I need time to process this. And I wanna make, I, I want a second opinion. And we actually waited another week. And I went to a specialist for an ultrasound and they said the same thing.

(42:05):

It sucked cuz I, I got there and the first thing she said was, oh yeah, okay. I see the SAC. So you are pregnant, you know? And, and then she kept looking and she was like, actually, yeah, there's, it's not there anymore. And by then I had been, you know, I told my husband, like, I just need to do this for me, but if it doesn't work out, then I'll let it go. You know? But I just needed to have that extra reassurance. We tried again during our wedding week, we had a destination wedding. So we were gone for a week and I got pregnant immediately. And I was like, oh my goodness, this is amazing. Like I must be so fertile. I remember thinking that. And it's crazy to think that now, because I've learned so much about my body and where I'm actually at, but at that time, that's what I thought.

(42:56):

And I just, I was so excited and we miscarried just a few weeks after the wedding you know, like a month or so after. And so it was just like devastating to go from like really, really high, you know, you're, you are, you have your wedding and you're super excited and you get pregnant and it just feels like all your dreams are coming true. And then I went from that to like a month later, devastated, cuz I had lost the pregnancy again and now we're newlyweds, you know, and I'm supposed to be happy and excited on a newlywed bliss, newlywed honeymoon. And instead I was like depressed. And so we tried we didn't, we, I, I miscarried naturally at home and then we found out like a month later that I was pregnant again. But then it, it didn't work out.

(43:53):

 I lost it again and it was just like this. I was just really down and I just was like, why is this happening? I don't understand why this is happening to me. Like what did I do wrong? I felt devastated. Doesn't begin to describe how I felt. I felt like my body was a prison. I, I told my husband, I felt like I was in a stray jacket. Like I wanted to escape. Like I wanted a new body <laugh> mm-hmm <affirmative> and we, I, I was just like, I need answers. And I became obsessed with getting answers. And because of that, we found out I have anti lipid syndrome, which is a blood cloting disorder and women who have this have like a 70 to 80% chance of having a miscarriage, stillbirth, hence my three losses. And that's, if they're not medically monitored, if you are, then you have a very high chance of getting to full term.

(44:49):

 And I have low AMH which means that I have low, I have less eggs from my age than I should. So I'm not fertile as fertile as I thought I was <laugh>. And now I've been working with an re I just changed clinics actually and we're trying out different things to help me get pregnant. So we've been trying again after a break and it hasn't happened even with like medicated cycles. And so we're trying to figure out what's going on now, but it's been like, like I said, a roller coaster ride and it's, you know, I just relate to Kelsey because it didn't start off that way. You know, it started off easy. It, I, would've never imagined that it would've turned into what it's become. I didn't at first want to take a pause. I was all over the place.

(45:40):

I was a confused mess. I was, you know, it was like, I don't wanna try again cause I'm scared, but I'm scared of taking a pause because what if it never happens? It was just overwhelming, but the pauses have allowed me time to be me again. And I, I, I recommend that because you can get lost in this journey. And that doesn't mean you won't find yourself again, but you can go through moments where you just feel like you lose yourself. And I think that that's why those pauses, those breaks can be so helpful. But I also highly recommend for anybody going through grief, trying to figure out what to do, how to get through it, to seek support, whether it's through a therapist, a bereavement coach an online community because it's people who find support groups have been shown to do better in general when going through any kind of grief or struggle that sense of community can be life changing.

(46:51):

 And also looking at the stages of grief because that helps you understand what you're going through and it just makes you feel more normal. You know, like if you're going from a moment of, I feel I'm like, you know confused and then angry and then I'm sad and then I'm happy and you're like, what's going on with me? Why am I feeling this way important to look up the stages of grief and understand that that's part of the process, you know these feelings are uncommon to us. It's something we're not familiar with. We're not prepared to handle them and knowing that and understanding, okay, I, I, this is new to me. This is something I didn't plan for. And I, and so therefore I didn't prepare for it allows you to accept like, and that's why I don't know what to do.

(47:46):

<Laugh> but that's okay because is I'm learning and I'll get through this little by little. But those are my recommendations. That's kind of what I did. And you know, every loss was different. I responded differently to it each time, but the most important thing is I'm still here. I'm still standing. And I just, that's my, my goal with what I do with sharing is to, yeah. It's, you know, to explain to people it's been rough, it's the worst thing that's ever happened to me. But look at me, I'm still okay. You know, you I've survived. The hardest thing that happened to me and that makes me feel like I am so strong and now I know I can overcome anything. And I, I hope that, you know, it's hard to see that when you're in the midst of it, but you can look back and say, wow, I really, I got through that, you know, and it gives you this sense of empowerment of I can do anything.

(48:47):

 I think that, you know, you gotta cross each bridge as you get there. I once read something about worrying about something that hasn't even happened yet and may never happen is like forcing yourself to experience it when you never even have to, you know, mm-hmm <affirmative> so definitely try to just take things day by day and cross each bridge as you get there. But also I think a lot of women who go through this, like I said earlier can lose themselves or lose sight of who they used to be. And I think it's so important to remember who you are, who you were before, and try to keep that, you know, try to keep a grasp that and always go back to that, you know, do things that make you feel like you,

Josephine Atluri (49:37):

All of these strong fertility advocates have inspired so many through their candor via their companies, podcasts, books, and social media profiles, definitely check out their individual interviews and previous responding to life episodes where you will hear in greater detail about their personal journeys and the strength and resilience it took for them to persevere. Plus they share so many lessons learned from their unique experiences, creating their families. I'll leave you all with one last thought about navigating infertility, one's path to parenthood and life overall from my amazing guests.

Samantha Busch (50:14):

This has been a long journey and a difficult one filled with a lot of emotions and a lot of tears and sorrow, but I wouldn't change it because through it, I've obviously had the most amazing son. I feel like my husband is my true partner. Like we've had to endure this together and it's made us a stronger team. We started a foundation because of it, which I know is like my life calling. And, you know, I know that God gave me this big, loud voice. That's not easily embarrassed and that I could go out and tell every nitty gritty detail so that hopefully somebody listening who has to go through this can gain some insight and either learn from my mistakes or, you know, find its hip that will help make their journey easier

Kim Hooper (51:11):

To try again or not. It it's such a personal thing. And I don't think that there's a right or a wrong path. So much is dependent on each person, what they think they can handle emotionally and physically what their relationship can handle. I think just being really E like honest with yourself and trying to block out all of those messages from other people who kind of push you one way or the other and, and just get to the heart of what you want and, and kind of what your spirit can handle.

Monica Bivas (51:39):

Something that I found a while ago. And it, it hit me because it kind of identify with the, the pain that I went through and also the healing. And it says time, that's not always heal all wounds, but discovering the truth has a funny way of shaping these scar. And it's, it's still true, you know? Yeah. They say time heals, but sometimes time takes forever. And then when we learn about our, our journey and we start to see why it happens and the truth of what happens in that journey, help us to check that scars, that they are still not healed.

Tina Sugandh (52:24):

And this sounds so silly, but I'll just run from my car to the door because I'm like, I have legs and I can run. And that's cool. Like, that's amazing. So I think we often forget to just look at our fingers and go, my fingers are moving. That's freaking something to be super, super grateful about. Again, I keep saying it, but that's, you just, all you can do is, is, is make a choice. Whether you're gonna look at the bright side or the stuff that sucks, cuz there's probab there's a whole bunch of each, right.

Kelsi Burley (52:49):

You know, I just wanna give back, like, I feel like I was so blessed to get so many wonderful women who supported me along the way that like bad day or good day, I feel so rewarding when I I'm helping someone else out. You know, it just, it feels good to give back and be there for someone,

Linny Stone (53:08):

You know, I've had four unsuccessful cycles. And so I have my days where I don't feel great. And I just take a pause, you know, and, and those days I focus on being okay and doing whatever I need to do lots of self care, long walks, you know, reading. And then I tell myself tomorrow the new day, that's my motto.

Josephine Atluri (53:33):

Thank you again to all of you for tuning in to this powerful episode, if you've experienced pregnancy loss or miscarriage, I hope you felt seen and heard as you listened to my guest are their own experiences. Fertility can feel like such an isolating season in life, but it's important to know that there are resources available to support you. As you navigate the challenges of trying to conceive. You can find each of the advocates, IG handles and websites. In the summary of this episode, I look forward to sharing another bonus fertility episode with you. You real soon, thank you again for tuning in to responding to life. Thank you for listening to responding to life talking health, fertility, and parenthood. If you enjoyed the show, I invite you to share it with others and leave a rating and review on whatever podcast outlet you use to learn more on how to apply mindfulness to your life. Please check out my book, the Mindfulness Journal for Parents, available on Amazon on my website, jatluri.com. You can also check out older podcast episodes and so many tips on infusing mindfulness into your life. Particularly if you are trying to conceive, experiencing infertility, managing your mental health or navigating parenthood, I offer affordable online mindfulness workshops as well as private online meditation sessions. Thank you again for your support. And I look forward to sharing another inspirational story with you real soon.

Josephine Atluri
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